Hiking
Plan Your Next Hike or Backpacking Trip
Whether you’re looking to go on your first day hike or your first overnight backpacking trip, we’ve got the guides and resources to help you plan the perfect trek.
Preparing for your first hike? We’ll tell you what to expect and what gear you need to make the most of the experience.
Looking to upgrade your experience or for some cool new trails? Our guides below can help you take your hikes to the next level.
Categories in Hiking
Latest in Hiking
Can You Hike In Birkenstocks?
When you think of brands that are synonymous with outdoorsy people, Birkenstock is definitely one of those brands. But are Birkenstocks something that you should wear out on the trail? No, most Birkenstocks are not good for hiking and should be avoided. However, Birkenstock has recently started making a few sandal models that you can
Essential Hiking Gear and Hiking Equipment (For Beginners)
To set out on day hikes on well-trodden trails, you don’t need a lot of equipment. That’s what makes hiking such a great activity. It’s accessible for a lot of people. All you really need is a decent forest and the will to get started. Well, that’s almost all you need. Hiking on will and
What To Wear Hiking In Cold Weather
Hiking in the cold is like doing any physically-challenging activity in the cold. You’ll get warm quicker than you think. But, unlike activities that keep you closer to civilization, hiking in the cold has a unique set of risks and challenges, and the clothing you wear isn’t just about comfort and movement; it’s about survival.
What To Wear Hiking In Hot Weather
Hiking in heat isn’t the same as standing still in heat, and you’ll get warm quicker than you might think. A perfect 70-degree day can feel like 90 degrees when you’re out on the trail, and the right clothing can mean the difference between a lovely day out and hellish misery. If you want to
What To Wear Hiking: Dressing For Your First Hike
Hiking is like any other outdoor exercise. It pits you against the elements, and how you dress for it doesn’t always match the weather outside. What’s “weather-appropriate” while hiking is different than what’s “weather-appropriate” when you’re just standing around. Layers matter when hiking. So do fabrics. And while you may not need an entire closet
Inspirational Hiking Quotes
Hiking is about more than just exercise. (Though, it’s great for that too.) It’s about escape. It’s about basking in nature and conquering terrains we don’t find in our civilized world. And hiking quotes tend to reflect that. The soul-lifting nature of hiking itself. The draw to the wild. The healing powers of wandering nowhere
Getting Started With Hiking (Beginners Hiking Guide)
Many people think hiking is just walking on wilder, more challenging terrain through pretty scenery. And to some extent, it is. That is hiking at its most basic definition. But the basic definition of hiking often leaves people ill-prepared for hiking’s impact on the body. That wilder, more challenging terrain uses considerably more muscles than
Why Is My Hydro Flask Sweating?
Hydro Flasks are designed to keep drinks cold (or hot) for more than 24 hours. They are also marketed this way. So, if you see your bottle sweating, you may wonder if you’ve been duped by a sales ploy. Well, Hydro Flasks shouldn’t sweat, so there is that. But a sweaty Hydro Flask doesn’t necessarily
Insulated Water Bottles We’d Stake Our Hydration On
When it comes to your water source, it’s not worth taking chances. Water is vital to your life, to your health, and, as far as fitness and outdoor recreation in concerned, to your energy and performance. If you’re going to be out in hot or cold weather, the best way to protect your water supply
Hiking Puns To Give You LOLs On The Trail
Hill-o, Hikers! Wood you like to be punny on your next hike? We’ve set out to find some of the purist hiking puns a-ground. We flip-flopped on which ones had the most swag and sure hope hill-arity ensues. So, tank up. Let’s hit the trail. Hiking: climb and punishment. Hiking changes my altitude. May the
Best Hiking Trails In Malibu For Awesome Views
Malibu is a gem in Southern California. The hot weather, rolling oceans, and sparkling beaches make it a no-brainer destination for any lover of fun in the sun. The beaches of Malibu are spectacular, but there’s plenty of fun to be had inland as well. Malibu has hills filled with dreamy vistas and seafront lookouts
Where To Go Hiking In San Antonio?
The Lone Star state is well-known for its stunning scenery and sprawling cities, and San Antonio is no exception. The city is massive, offering residents an incredible selection of food, entertainment, job opportunities. However, if you’re like me, you need to get out of the city every now and then. If you’re interested in exploring
What Does ‘Out And Back Trail’ Mean For Hikers?
Planning a safe hike always requires planning. Before you lace up your boots or strap on your backpack, you will need do some research into what type of trail you will be hiking, as well as the length and terrain. The hiking world is full of language that can bring up questions for new and
Can You Glue Your Boot Sole Back On With Gorilla Glue? (Quick Hiking Shoes Fix)
We’ve all got that one pair of hiking boots that we just don’t want to part with. They’re old and well worn, but still comfortable and reliable on the trail. Until one day when you’re out trekking and the sole comes apart from the rest of the boot. What do you do? Can you save
Average Hiking Speed: What Is It And How To Calculate Your Pace
For most people heading out on a hiking trail, the thought of hiking speed or pace never really comes up. But if you’re more than a leisure hiker, then knowing your speed is important as you plan long treks. Being able to calculate your pace ensures that you make it off the trail by dark;
Alpaca Wool vs Merino Sheep Wool: What’s The Difference?
My favorite things to wear hiking are my merino wool socks and shirts. I feel like they’re the perfect attire for outdoor adventures, as well as travel. But not everyone can wear merino wool because some people are allergic to it. So when I recently learned about alpaca wool, I was excited to see if
How To Waterproof A Backpack [Tips for Any Backpack]
If you’re planning a day hike or other outdoor adventure, then you might want to consider how waterproof your backpack is (in case it rains on you). While plenty of high end packs some with rain covers, your average cheap daypack does not. So, what do you do if there’s a chance of rain in
Patagonia Down Sweater vs. Nano Puff: Which Is Better For Outdoor Adventures?
Feeling the sometimes bitter cold of the wilderness is enough to make any person head to the nearest warm cabin they can find. But what if you are a backpacker or camper who does not have that luxury? Truth be told, if you enjoy backpacking, especially if you do regular treks during the colder fall
MRE vs. Mountain House: Which Is Better?
Backpacking is one of those activities that is both peaceful and exhilarating. Nothing can beat the serenity you feel as you traverse through untouched wilderness or the excitement that comes from tackling new and unique challenges. And while backpacking is certainly ultra-enjoyable, so too is the experience of camping under the stars once you have
How To Spot Fake Patagonia Gear
Are you in the market for Patagonia clothing but afraid you might get ripped off by some of the more nefarious dealers that market and sell fake gear? If so, you have come to the right place. In this article we will not only provide a quick story about Patagonia and the clothing and accessories
How To Store Your Hiking Gear To Prevent Mildew
It’s summer, which means there’s no better time for a hike! Before you remove those boots and stash them away for next weekend, though, it’s crucial to take a step back. You never want to discover that your equipment has started to emit a nasty odor. Fortunately, it doesn’t take much effort to ensure that
How To Attach A Sleeping Pad To Your Backpack
Nothing matches the fun and adventure of backpacking; the fun of exploring the backcountry of this great country and taking in all of the gorgeous flora and fauna it offers. One of the keys to a successful backpacking adventure is a pack that is loaded up correctly and thoroughly, with all the gear one might
How To Avoid Leeches While Hiking (and How To Get Them Off)
If you’re doing some hiking in a rainforest or anywhere else that leeches can be found, then it’s a good idea to prepare yourself for the inevitable. Those blood-thirty little suckers will ruin an otherwise good hike. So we’ve got some tips on how to avoid them and what to do if some have already
How To Attach A Sleeping Bag To A Backpack (4 Ways To Secure It)
Planning a backpacking trip and looking for ways to maximize the available space in your pack? One easy way to free up more space in your backpack is to attach your sleeping bag to the exterior of the pack, instead of stuffing it inside with the rest of your gear. As you might have guessed,
How To Get In Shape For A Thru-Hike (Physical & Mental Tips)
Have you dreamed about a trek on the Appalachian Trail? If you’re an avid hiker, you’ve likely considered this trip at least once or twice. Like all thru-hikes, preparation needs to be a top priority — otherwise, you won’t make it to the finish line. You have to get in shape, mentally and physically, before
Daypack vs Backpack: Which Is Better For Hiking & Travel?
So, you’re planning a hike and you need a pack to carry your water, some snacks, and maybe some other things like sunscreen, a compass, and your cell phone. Do you just grab any old backpack out of your closet, or do you head to REI to get yourself a daypack just for hiking? Does
How To Break In Chacos Fast Before Your Next Adventure
So, you’ve just got yourself a new pair of Chacos hiking sandals, but your outdoor adventure is soon and you don’t want to get blisters. You might be panicking now with lot of questions running through your mind. How long does it take to break-in a pair of Chacos? And how can you speed up
Thru-Hiking Basics For Beginners
While certain members of the backpacking community are satisfied with hiking partial trails and the easier routes that can that can be completed in just a day or two, there is another group of individuals with an entirely different view of hiking: the thru-hikers. Thru-hikers can only be described as master outdoorspeople, and they come
Solo Backpacking Tips For Beginners
Backpacking, whether on trails, the deep woods or simply globetrotting around the world, can be a glorious pursuit. The activity gives you the time and opportunity to commune with nature, to escape from the hustle and bustle of your everyday life, to meet new like-minded people and see parts of the world of which others
What To Wear Backpacking (A Beginner’s Guide)
Are you planning a backpacking trip through some trails in the backcountry? Have you considered everything you need to do regarding this backpacking trip, including what you will wear when hiking these wilderness trails? If you have yet to take this step, the following article may be very instructive. Here we will talk about some
Backpacking Meal Planning Tips For Beginners
Backpacking is an amazingly fun pursuit, giving individuals the chance to get closer to nature as they test their endurance and resolve on some of America’s finest trails. However, in order to backpack actively, safely and keep one’s energy, you will need to bring along some well-planned meals and snacks—food that will give you the
How To Go Backpacking With Kids
If your family is like most in America today, chances are your children have become immersed in the technological craze that is spreading like wildfire throughout the world—and has been spreading for some time now. From video games to Facebook to Instagram to texting, the average child now spends much more time online than they
How To Plan A Backpacking Trip
Whether you are new to backpacking or a very experienced hiker, there are several factors to consider and plenty of things to do when planning a backpacking trip. To help you get ready for your next big excursion or trek, in this article we will cover some of the decisions you will need to make,
Intro to Backpacking: A Beginner’s Guide To Preparing For Your First Backpacking Trip
Have you ever dreamed of spending a few days, a week or perhaps even a month walking along a backcountry trail, seeing some of the most majestic natural features the mountainous wilderness has to offer? Do you enjoy the idea of an exercise routine in the great outdoors? If you do, then the sport of
Cook Up Tasty Meals With The Best Backpacking Frying Pan (2022)
As outdoorsy folks, we’re always looking for durable, dependable, and compact equipment to make our packs lighter and our trips more manageable. When it comes to cooking equipment, you want to make sure that your pans are durable and compact enough to sustain your journey, but also will quickly and efficiently cook up a much needed
11 Best Dog Breeds For Off-Leash Hiking
As a hiker, you know there is nothing better than getting a chance to explore the outdoors. Connecting with nature and experiencing the beauty that surrounds you can be hard to beat, unless of course you can share that experience with your four-legged friend. Having a dog hike along with you gives you companionship and
Last Minute Shopper? These Make Awesome Gifts For Outdoorsy People
Got someone active and outdoorsy on your gift shopping list? Whether you’re shopping for a mountain biking enthusiasts or a snowshoer, there are a few gift options out there that are perfect for all outdoor lovers. It doesn’t matter the occasion – Christmas, birthdays, or some other special day – the gift ideas below are
Hit The Trail With The Best Daypacks for Travel and Hiking
Daypacks are great when you have a lot of stuff to carry around all day. You can put it in your pack and forget about it until you need it, and when you do, you have it. Sounds pretty simple, and it really is. Where it gets more complicated is picking out the one best
REI’s Gear Up, Get Out Sale: 13 Awesome Outdoor Gift Ideas [Our Top Picks]
I buy all of my outdoor gear from only a few different places, with one of them being REI. One of the things that I love about REI is that they’re basically a one-stop shop for all your outdoor needs – from hiking boots to trail snacks to mountain bikes to GoPros. Getting a sale
Stay Dry With The Best Waterproof Hiking Pants For Women (2021)
Having lived in Las Vegas for the last four years, most of my hiking has been in dry weather. But once I started planning hiking trips in other states, I quickly realized that I needed some pants that would keep me dry in rainy weather. Have you tried looking for women’s waterproof hiking pants at
What To Do If You See A Bear When Hiking Or Camping
If you enjoy hiking or camping in wilderness areas, whether developed or completely wild, chances are you may one day encounter a bear. This can be a very scary proposition to say the least, especially if you have no idea what to do should this situation present itself. So, just what are you supposed to
How To Identify A Water Moccasin (Cottonmouth Snakes)
There are many people out there that erroneously assume every swimming or water snake is a water moccasin. Nothing could actually be further from the truth. In fact, most snakes can technically swim, even those you might not think could like the diamond head rattlesnake. And in the places where water moccasins actually live and
Winter Hiking Safety Tips
There is something immensely beautiful about hiking with a blanket of snow around you. It feels so peaceful and helps promote a healthy lifestyle. However, without preparation, it can be incredibly dangerous. In this article, we will take a look at how to keep yourself safe while hiking during the winter. Preparation Arguably, the most
10 Best Places In The USA To Hike In The Winter
We’re enjoying the first week of fall in most of the country, and it’s the perfect time to start planning your winter hikes. Winter is the best time to hike if you enjoy cold weather and having the trails to yourself. If you’re not sure where to start looking, here is a list of the
How To Prevent And Treat Butt Chafing While Hiking (Or Running)
It doesn’t matter what you call it – monkey butt, swamp ass, butt cheek chafing – one thing is certain, getting your bum too sweaty from hiking or running can result a very uncomfortable feeling. If you’ve experienced this painful side effect of being active, then you know what I’m talking about. And if you
Osprey Atmos AG vs Aether AG: Which Is The Better Backpacking Backpack?
Having the right backpack for all your outdoor adventures is crucial, but do you know what to look for in a high-quality backpack. If not, the following article should be very illuminating. Here we have reviewed two of the best and most popular backpack models on the planet, the Osprey Atmos AG Backpack and the
What Indicates That Foul Weather Is Approaching?
If you have camped more than just a few times in your life, you already know quite well that foul weather can be a very real possibility, especially if you are camping in wilderness areas in the mountains. Even during the summer months, it is not uncommon to experience an afternoon thunderstorm, complete with lightning,
How To Fix Heel Slippage In Your Hiking Boots
Whether you are a hiker, outdoorsperson, camper, construction worker, law enforcement officer or in the military, the ability to be comfortable when wearing boots is paramount to your profession or your hobby pursuits. However, one very real problem that can quickly take away from that comfort is the problem of heel slippage. Heel slippage when
How To Wash Your North Face Jacket Without Damaging It
So, you finally saved up the money to buy a one-of-a-kind The North Face jacket—the crème of the crop among your outdoors buddies. These jackets, whether waterproof or not, provide a lot of protection against the cold, water and wind, and are the jackets of choice for most serious hikers, mountaineers, campers and other outdoor
Bad Weather Keeping You Inside? Here’s 10 Hiking Movies To Watch
Is there anything better than seeing an activity you love and regularly participate in portrayed on the big screen? For outdoors people, this is the thrill they feel when they watch one of the many great hiking movies that have been made, some of which feature the biggest stars of our day. If you are
How To Get Tree Sap Out Of Clothes (and Shoes)
If you have ever got tree sap on your clothes, you already know how frustrating it can be. That’s because trying to get tree sap out of your clothes always seems like a losing proposition. Odds are, if you are an avid outdoors enthusiast, you have probably even thrown an article of clothing or two
Osprey Farpoint 40 Backpack vs. Osprey Porter 46 Backpack (for hiking & travel)
Are you looking for a backpack that is strong and comfortable enough for all of your adventures? If so, the following article may be of particular interest to you. Here we will review two very durable and versatile backpacks—the Osprey Farpoint 40 Backpack and the Osprey Porter 46 Backpack—and highlight the pros and cons of
5 Of The Most Scenic Hikes To Take in Hawaii
If you’re taking a trip to Hawaii for some island hopping, you might be going for the incredible weather and pristine beaches – or you may be going for the hike of your lifetime. Because of Hawaii’s volcanic activity, the terrain is extremely varied, mountainous, and beautiful. If you can go hiking anywhere in the
Keep Your Junk Fresh With The Best Hiking Underwear For Men
Are you in the market for a pair of men’s hiking underwear—underwear that can keep you cool and dry during your many outdoor adventures? If so, the following article just might be able to help. Here we have reviewed several of the hottest-selling and most advantageous pairs of men’s underwear for hiking, and highlighted the
How To Use A Compass And Map For Navigation
If you are a regular hiker, or just someone who enjoys spending time outdoors, there may come a time when you will have to use a map and a compass to determine where you are and where you need to go. However, in order to accomplish this task, it is crucial that you have the
Types of Backpacks for Outdoor Adventures
There are many different types of backpacks for your outdoor adventures, from various types of daypacks to large backpacks that are perfect for overnight trips. In this article we will highlight several different types of backpacks that are perfect for the great outdoors, and provide a brief yet detailed description of each type of backpack.
Staying Safe In The Wild: Bear Spray vs. Pepper Spray
There has long been a debate between pepper spray and bear spray and which type to use in different attack situations. Bear spray has proven effective countless of times in the wild, and many would-be victims of bears and other wildlife attacks owe their lives to the bear spray formula and dispersion device. Pepper spray
7 Amazing Hiking Trails in Australia
If you’re contemplating an Australian holiday to take advantage of our hiking trails, you’re certainly going to be spoiled for choice. One of the biggest perks to a country as large and as open as Australia is that there are so many fantastic hiking spots, regardless of the capital city or state you’re staying or
Chacos vs Teva: Which Is The Better Adventure Sandal (for Hiking, Rafting, Travel & More)
As an avid hiker who lives in Las Vegas, I’m a big fan of hiking sandals when the weather is hot and the terrain isn’t too treacherous. While my go-to pair of hiking sandals are a pair of Keens, I also own a pair of Tevas and used to own a pair of Chacos. So,
Hiking and Your Health: Here’s What You Need to Know
If you’re just starting out as a hiker, or even if you’ve been hitting the trails on the regular this year, you may have been wondering how it stacks up as a healthy activity. After all, there’s a lot of variability in what people consider a hike. One person’s 2 miles on a groomed trail
Need An Excuse To Get Outside? Check Out Some Of The Awesome Benefits Of Hiking
Hiking is a wonderful and extremely healthy activity, one that offers an immeasurable number of physical, mental and emotional benefits. In fact, for some, hiking is much more than a great outdoor activity, it’s a lifestyle. Although walking around a track or a suburb can offer many health benefits, with hiking those benefits are multiplied
Staying Hydrated On The Trail: Best Stainless Steel Water Bottle For Hiking
Since I currently live in the desert and have a ton of awesome hiking spots nearby, staying hydrated on the trail is super important to me. If you’ve ever hiked in the dry desert climate, then you know why I’m so vigilant about making sure I drink enough water out there. And since it’s rather
Where To Go Hiking and Biking in Saratoga Springs, NY Area
Saratoga Springs, New York offers beautiful natural spaces for hiking, biking and other recreational activities. Here are some of the best nature trails in the area for you and your family to enjoy. Ballston Veterans Bike Path This walking trail, which is flat, straight and paved with asphalt, is perfect for hikes, skating and bike
Tailwind Nutrition Rebuild Recovery Review: Does It Work For Hikers?
If you do a lot of hiking, then you know at the end of the day you end up just feeling beat – sore feet, tired legs, and you kinda just don’t want to move. While I tend to think of these feelings as a day well spent, I can’t deny the appeal of eliminating
How To Adjust The Declination On Your Compass
Modern technology is not a prerequisite for successful navigation. The basic navigation skills are enough and essential to any survivalist or outdoorsman and especially people into sailing. Pinpointing true north is amongst the basic essential skills required by sailors, outdoorsmen, and survivalists. This skill is challenging in that a compass denotes magnetic north instead of true north, that
What’s The Average Life Span Of Your Hiking Boots?
Achy feet, soggy socks, and maybe a hole here and there – at some point, we all have to get rid of our favorite pair of hiking boots and replace them with new ones. And if you’re like me, then you’re not really that stoked about replacing them since they’ve been on so many treks
Trail Tested: Best Women’s Hiking Boots for Beginners [Any Season or Terrain]
Without a doubt, hiking is my number one favorite outdoor activity. But as a woman, it’s hard to find good resources on hiking boots to meet my trail needs. As you may have noticed, most articles and review round-ups focus on gear for guys, which makes it difficult for us ladies to know what’s worth
Hiking Sandals: Should You Wear Them & How To Choose The Right Pair
If you’re going hiking where it’s really hot, or where you’ll have to cross some water, then you might be considering trading in your hiking boots for a pair of hiking sandals. I don’t blame you! I did the exact same thing last summer before visiting some national parks. Choosing the right pair is important
Break In Your Hiking Boots The Right Way With These Tips
You don’t go on conquering the highest peak around after just a few daily hikes. The same goes for breaking in new hiking boots. You need to advance gradually by layering new hikes and trails one after the other with increasing difficulty and length in order to do both. If you have made the mistake
The 10 Most Gorgeous & Underrated US Hiking Trails
Looking to take a long weekend and experience some of the best trails that the U.S. has to offer? Instead of hitting up your usual spots, take the path less travelled and check out one of these awesome and underrated trails recommend by our friend Brian at Boot Bomb. Who knows, one of these just
13 Best Foods For A Day Hike
When you’re preparing to go out for a day hike, whether it’s an easy mile or a more strenuous 8-mile hike, taking enough (and the right) snacks to keep your energy levels up is a priority. Sure, we all know how important it is to bring along the proper amount of water for hydration, but
Hiking the Tongariro Alpine Crossing – New Zealand’s “Best One-Day Hike”
Guest post by Clare, travel blogger at Altitude Treks – for everything high-altitude. Hike details: Where: North Island, New Zealand Length: 19.4km, 12 miles. Allow 7-9 hours (I completed in 7hrs 15minutes) Elevation gain: Start: 1100 m to Red Crater 1886 m to End 800 m The Tongariro Alpine Crossing is touted in guide books
What To Consider Before Hiking With Your Dog
Gearing up to hit the trail at your local national park or other hiking spot? If you’re like some pet owners, then you might be planning on taking your dog with you out on the trail. But before loading the dog up in the car, take a moment to consider if you should really bring your
Backpacker Necessities: Find the Best Backpacking Stove For The Money
Unlike with day hikes, when you set out on a backpacking trip you won’t want to limit your food intake to trail mix, energy bars, and peanut butter sandwiches. Sure, you can do that if you like, but your experience will likely end up being much better if you can make a hot meal or
How To Care For (And Extend The Life Of) Your Hiking Boots
You’ve gone through all the trouble of finding the perfect pair of hiking boots, so why not take good care of them and extend the life of those hiking boots so that you really get your money’s worth out of the purchase. Cause let’s face it, hiking boots aren’t cheap so extending their useful life
The Hiking, Camping and Cycling Gear You Didn’t Know You Needed: VSSL Cache
Whenever I go hiking, I like to carry as little in my pack as possible without sacrificing anything that I really need. For me, hiking necessities include things like water, energy boosting snacks, some type of first aid supplies, sunscreen, and anything else that is season-relevant. Typically, I just toss these things into a daypack
Hiking Safety Tips for Beginners (and Reminders for Experienced Hikers!)
An important part of enjoying your hikes is being a responsible hiker. This means that no matter how many times you’ve been on the trail, how much awesome safety gear you have with you, or how confident you are with your athletic and physical fitness levels, safety awareness is a must for all hikers. With
5 Best Volcano Hikes in South America
The sheer power and immensity of volcanoes inspires not only curiosity and wonder, but also creates a magnetic draw, a desire to master or take part in something so fascinating. In fact, people have been hiking and exploring them since the beginning of mankind. While hiking up an active volcano may seem a little too
Use Only The Best Hiking Backpacks For Your Hikes
If you are planning a hiking trip or are just thinking about picking it up as a hobby, having the perfect gear is an important part of taking that hike. The backpack you end up choosing is one of the most important parts of your hiking gear since it actually holds your gear. There is
Finding The Right Trekking Poles For More Than Just Backpacking
Most of us who are active think that we have a pretty good grasp on the whole walking thing, right? And sure, doing a simple hike in a local park might not require a good walking stick, but for serious treks you should consider getting yourself some good trekking poles. These are not just for
Prevent Sunburn When Cycling or Hiking With UV Sun Sleeves
As someone who enjoys spending as much time as possible outside enjoying the sun and nature, I also have to deal with balancing that time against the possibility of getting sunburned. We all know that getting sunburn regularly is a good way to end up with skin cancer, and no one wants that. But, I